Who Are the 144,000 Spoken of in Scripture?

Who are the 144,000?

Look at the book, "Opening the Seven Seals" by Richard Draper for potential source material.

The 144,000 is symbolic of all the Saints (past, present, and future) who are saved in the Celestial Kingdom – that's one of the possible interpretations. All of the billions and trillions of God's children who go to the Celestial Kingdom is symbolized by the 144,000; and now, I will try to explain how it is so.

Joseph Smith said that of all the languages on this earth, ancient Hebrew is the language that is closest to the language that God speaks and writes.

In Hebrew 12 is one of the perfect numbers. In Hebrew, 12 is actually the highest of the perfect numbers. (3, 7, 10, and 12 are the perfect numbers). In Greek the word for perfect (teleos) really means to be complete or whole, meaning to be completed by God or to be finished by God, meaning to return to the Celestial Kingdom and become a God yourself. That's how you are completed by God or perfected by God. What do you get when you multiply 12 by 12? You get 144. You get ultimate perfection times ultimate perfection. 144 is perfection multiplied by perfection, or "ultimate perfection squared". This is completeness completed, or the Saints of God being made into Gods and Goddesses in the Celestial Kingdom. The 144 represents people who are perfected or completed and exalted in the Celestial Kingdom. So, how many of them will there be?

Richard Draper also explained that when some number is multiplied by 10, 100, or 1000 in the Hebrew language; then it's that thing 10-fold, 100-fold, or 1000-fold. These numbers are multipliers, with 1000 being the highest or ultimate multiplier in the ancient Hebrew language. This is all part of the Gematria of the Hebrew language. In Hebrew a 1000 tends to be the highest multiplier or the ultimate multiplier and sometimes symbolizes infinity. This multiplier tells us that an infinite number of God's children will be 144'd, or receive ultimate completeness and perfection. To be 144'd is to be Exalted in the Celestial Kingdom or the Kingdom of God.

So in this case, the 144,000 represents symbolically "completeness completed a thousand times over" or "perfection squared a thousand times over" or "ultimate perfection squared all multiplied by infinity". This means that billions and trillions of God's children are going to be saved in the Celestial Kingdom thanks to the atonement of Jesus Christ. If you are a baptized Latter-day Saint or former-day Saint who has been baptized by real Priesthood Authority, and you keep all your baptismal covenants for the rest of your life by repenting of your sins, then you are one of the 144,000 or one of the billions of Completed individuals who will enter into the Celestial Kingdom and take up residence with the Gods, maybe one day even becoming a God yourself. Cool, huh?

Notice the multiplier here. The multiplier is 1000. What does the 1000 symbolize? It symbolizes the number of people who will be Exalted in the Celestial Kingdom and one day become Gods and Goddesses. What is 1000? It is 10 times 10 times 10, or “perfection cubed”. 1000 as a multiplier is perfection completed or perfection whole, or perfection times perfection times perfection, in the ancient Hebrew language. 1000 is the ultimate multiplier. And, that's the number of people who will be Exalted in the Kingdom of God or Celestial Kingdom.

So, what does the word or number 1000 really symbolize or mean in the ancient Hebrew language? It means infinity. It's their way of representing infinity or starting to represent infinity, especially when used as a multiplier as it is with the 144,000. 1000 as a multiplier represents infinity perfected, or infinity cubed, or infinity raised to infinity. This means that an infinite number of Gods children will be Exalted in the Celestial Kingdom. It means that there is room enough even for me and you. It means that God's work is One Eternal Round without end. It means that when you go to the Celestial Kingdom your seed and your spirit children saved and exalted in the Celestial Kingdom will be infinite in number. Cool huh?

 

The 144,000 will be known or recognized as those who make and keep covenants with God and have their covenants sealed or ratified by Priesthood Authority, Baptism of Water and Fire, and all sealed by the Holy Spirit of Promise. Again, it is perfection times perfection; doing it all the right way or the authorized way. These are the people who come into the Kingdom of God (or LDS Church) by the right gate and choose to stay in the Kingdom once they get there. These are the ones who will be Completed and go to the Celestial Kingdom in the next life. They will become co-heirs with Jesus Christ, or heirs of Exaltation in the Celestial Kingdom. That's the 144,000 that the scriptures are really talking about. It's you and me if we want it to be.

Believing and Willing Truth into Existence Where It Didn't Exist Before:

Now I am going to try to play this concept through to the end, exploring it from all angles in an attempt to come to a real understanding of the idea. There will be some parallelism or repetition going on. Bear with me.

LDS apostates, anti-Brethren, anti-Authority, and anti-Christs will eagerly come forth and say that my particular interpretation of the 144,000 is wrong; and, guess what? They are right. For them, the interpretation stating that the 144,000 are the heirs of Exaltation in the Celestial Kingdom and joint-heirs with Christ is indeed the wrong interpretation for them, because they do not qualify to be heirs of Exaltation. They choose not to go in the right gate, so they choose not to be heirs of Exaltation; therefore, the claim that the 144,000 are all the heirs of Exaltation (whether true or false) does not apply to them and is wrong for them.

They need some other interpretation for the 144,000 in order to make the concept realistic or useful for them; and, any other interpretation that does so is right for them. For them, any other interpretation for 144,000 that soothes their conscience or strokes their ego is much more correct and accurate than the one I have given here. This concept is extremely important, so I will now pursue it further, because I have realized that this is one of the keys to understanding the mysteries of God or understanding how God and “Faith in Christ” really work.

We are talking about truth here. Some people will complain and say, “Why are you so sure that your particular interpretation of the 144,000 is the right interpretation? Why are you so sure that it is true?” It's because I know and believe that for all the billions and trillions who one day receive Exaltation in the Celestial Kingdom they are part of the 144,000 spoken of in scripture and my interpretation of the concept applies directly to them. The 144,000 are the joint-heirs with Christ in the Celestial Kingdom, and my interpretation of the concept only applies to the joint-heirs with Christ. In other words, my interpretation is only true or useful when it is applied to the recipients of Exaltation or the joint-heirs with Christ. For all others, my interpretation does not apply and it is actually the wrong interpretation or a worthless interpretation for them, because they don't qualify for Exaltation in the Kingdom of Heaven or the Celestial Kingdom.

Human beings are marvelous god-like beings. We actually have the power to will things into existence or to believe things into existence. We actually have the power to accept Christ's Church, accept Christ's Ordinances, accept Christ's Duly Authorized Servants, accept and keep His commandments, and make and keep covenants with God. When we do these things believing that Christ will keep His covenants and fulfill His promises, we actually choose our Exaltation into existence or will our Exaltation into existence or believe our Exaltation into existence. Faith without works is dead. The works part is choosing to believe Christ when He says that He can save you and exalt you. The works part is choosing to do it all Christ's way through repentance or forsaking your own sins, baptism by real priesthood authority into His Kingdom or Church on earth, receiving the Holy Ghost or baptism of fire into your life, and making covenants with God to seek and keep His commandments for the rest of your existence.

I never liked the term “enduring to the end” because it has a negative connotation and implies “suffering to the end” or “fighting to the end” or “hating every minute of it to the end”. It also has the word “end” in it, and where God is concerned there is no end. I prefer the idea of “enjoying Christ and the Gospel for the rest of Eternity” or “enjoying Exaltation for the rest of Eternity” or “loving and living our Eternal Life for the rest of our existence”. In a sense, it's choosing to do all things Christ's way and God's way for the rest of our existence. It's choosing to be happy, or “in God”, or blessed for the rest of our existence. So, maybe from the Beatitudes, it is being “Blessed to the End” instead of simply enduring to the end? I suggest that it really should be “Blessed for all Eternity” rather than just “enduring to the end”.

“Enduring to the end” should really be changed to “Being Happy for all Eternity”.

If we accept Christ in faith and choose to do all things His way, we actually will our Exaltation into existence or choose it into existence where it never existed before. For us, our Exaltation in the Celestial Kingdom or our becoming part of the 144,000 actually becomes real and true for us, because through belief and works we willed it into existence or chose it into existence by trusting and having faith in Christ. Without Christ and His Atonement, it is not possible for any of us to choose Exaltation or to will Exaltation into existence. In a sense, we will this particular truth into existence or believe it into existence where it never existed before by desiring it into existence; and then, our resurrected Lord Jesus Christ actually gives us a way to do the works necessary to make it all possible in our lives. We desire Exaltation, and then Christ makes it possible to receive a full measure of our righteous desires. Cool huh?

If you want to will your membership in the 144,000 into existence, Christ has actually given us the method and the possibility to do so. In other words, if you want to will your Exaltation or work your Exaltation into existence, Jesus Christ has given each one of us the means to do so. On the other hand, those who don't want to have anything with Christ's Church, Christ's Priesthood, Christ's Commandments, Christ's Ordinances, Christ's Authorized Servants, or Christ's Exaltation will simply lack the power to believe such a thing into existence for themselves in their own lives. In other words, they won't be able to qualify for Exaltation in the Celestial Kingdom having chosen to pass through some other gate instead. That's the power of faith, particularly faith in Christ. Through Christ, we each have the power or the ability to believe and work our way into the Celestial Kingdom, or to believe and work our way right out of it. Either way, whatever we choose to believe and accept or whatever we choose to have faith in will become true for us. It will become our own personal reality in the end.

God won't force us to Heaven and won't force us into Heaven if we don't want to go. God won't force us into His Church and won't force us to go to church if we don't want to go. God won't force us to believe in Him or to trust Him, if we choose not to do so. God won't force us to follow the Brethren and won't force us to keep the commandments that He gives us through the Brethren, if we don't want to do so. God won't force us into Exaltation and won't force us to become part of the 144,000 if we don't want to do so. God always gives us what we want most. That's the way it works. God can only work with and exalt the willing. God can't help those who don't want to have anything to do with it, or Him.

Through faith in Christ and the Atonement of Christ we gain the power and the ability to make Exaltation a truth or a reality within our own personal lives. We actually will the truth into existence or will the reality into existence. Likewise, the atheists also will their reality or their truth into existence for them as well. See how that works?

What's true for one person or possible for one person is completely false and completely impossible for the other person. We each get what we want most, and we each get what we believe to be possible or true. In the end, your truth or reality will be whatever you choose for it to be. So, how does Christ fit into all of this if we believe our own reality into existence? Jesus Christ provides a way for all of your righteous desires or all of your right desires to come true. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. Without Christ, there would be no Celestial Kingdom for any of us to desire or dream about, because without Christ it is impossible for any of us to go to the Celestial Kingdom. Jesus Christ is the one who unlocked the gate and opened the door that leads into the Celestial Kingdom; and, we each can go there if we are willing to do all things His way or willing to follow His example and do exactly what He did to get there.

Jesus Christ is the one who showed us the way. Jesus Christ is the one who made the Celestial Kingdom a true or realistic possibility for each one of us. Jesus came to give us life and to give it more abundantly. Why? It's because Jesus came to give us the chance to have Eternal Life in the presence of God; and, Jesus came to help us to have good lives or better lives while we live here in mortality as well. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. It fits, but we have to be willing to look and see and accept that it is so.

If you don't believe that any of this is possible, then you are right, it's not possible for you. If you don't believe that you can become part of the 144,000 by doing it all Christ's way, then you are right, it's not possible for you to do so. If you don't want to follow Christ and His Duly Authorized Servants, then it's not going to be possible for you to do so. If you don't want to go to church, don't want to keep God's commandments, and don't want to go where Christ has gone, then it's not going to happen for you. If you don't want to have anything to do with Christ and His Church, it will be so; and, it will become your own personal truth. You will be “without God” in the world. You will be given exactly what you want most.

Exaltation is only possible or true for those who choose to believe in Christ, choose to do all things Christ's way, and choose to believe that He can indeed save them and exalt them in the Kingdom of God. It's only possible for those who choose to come in the right way through the right gate. What's the right way? It's Christ's way. What's the right gate, it's literally the gate that leads into the Celestial Kingdom.

The LDS scriptures tell us that the gate to the Celestial Kingdom is baptism into the LDS Church (Christ's Own Church) by real Priesthood Authority (Christ's Priesthood) and having it all sealed, verified, or ratified by the Holy Spirit of Promise (Holy Ghost) certifying that we have indeed kept all of our baptismal covenants, repented of or forsaken all of our sins, and have chosen to keep all of Gods commandments for the rest of our existence. The gate to the Celestial Kingdom is unlocked to all of those who have chosen to do everything Christ's way or have chosen to believe and follow Christ in every way possible.

Are we saved by Grace or are we saved by Works? The answer is “Yes”. If we were saved only by grace then everyone, even the devils and the most evil of men, would go to the Celestial Kingdom and become joint-heirs with Christ. Yet the Bible tells us that it is not so. Only those who do the works required by Christ will receive a full measure of the grace of Christ. Only those who do it all Christ's way will end up going where Christ has gone. Only those who enter in by the right gate will actually end up in the Celestial Kingdom or the Highest Degree of Heaven. Those who do evils works, those who do the incorrect works, and those who do no works will all go someplace else. Those who do not qualify for the grace of Christ will not receive a full measure of the grace of Christ. Does that make sense? Does that seem fair? Or should all the devils, murderers, pedophiles, genocidal, and the most vile go where Christ has gone? Thinking about it logically, what seems proper to you?

It has been said that if one were to take all of the people in Heaven and put them in hell, and take all the people in hell and put them in Heaven, before long Heaven would become hell, and hell would become Heaven. Heaven is not about the destination or the location, but is all about the people who live there. Interesting, huh?

If you choose to believe that Christ can make you a part of the 144,000 by doing it all His way, then it will be so. If you choose to believe that He doesn't exist or that He can't do it, then it will be so for you; and then, my particular interpretation of the 144,000 will no longer apply to you and will actually be false for you. If you choose to reject Christ, His Ordinances, His Church, and His Gospel, then any other interpretation for the meaning of the 144,000 will actually be better for you or more true for you, because you are not willing or able to make my particular interpretation true for you. When it comes to entry in the Celestial Kingdom, God can only work with the willing and God can only help the willing; and, those who don't want to have anything to do with it will be unwilling and unable to take the steps necessary to qualify for it. See how that works?

We believe our own reality into existence or choose our own reality into existence. In the end, our righteous desires or our evil desires become our ultimate truth or our ultimate reality and destination. We will our future into existence where it never existed before. God always gives us what we want most. This is the true nature and the true result of choosing to have Faith in God, or choosing to reject God. It all becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Even the atheists are prophets in the secular sense of the word, given the fact that by refusing to seek, find, and obey God, they will never find God and never have God in their lives.

Consequently, my particular interpretation for the term 144,000 is both true and false, all depending upon the person(s) you are talking about. Strange, huh? But, the fallen man or the natural man simply isn't used to seeing these things this way. They can't seem to comprehend how something can be both true and false all at the same time. Instead, they will often say, “My interpretation of the 144,000 is the right one, and all the others are wrong”, when in fact their personal interpretation might truly be 100% true or right for them yet be completely wrong or false for me and you. Interesting, huh?

In the end, you are your own reward. You are also your own punishment as well. It's your choice. Christ simply gives us the means to have it all His way; and, His way is the best way, especially if you choose to believe that it is so. Christ's way is the right way or the true way, especially when you choose to make it right and true for you. You are part of the 144,000 or become part of the 144,000, when you choose to do it all Christ's way and actually do it all Christ's way for the rest of your existence. Cool, huh?

Some call this the Gospel of If. If we do it all God's way, then we will be saved and exalted His way. In other words, if we do it Christ's way, then we will go where Christ has gone. That's why Christ invites us and even commands us to “Come Follow Me”, so that in the end we will go where He has gone. Jesus Christ is asking us to join The Ultimate Movement, the only movement that will truly make a real difference in our lives and in our Eternal Lives.

It's hard to see all of this at first, but don't give up until you do. It's a valuable insight. Now that I have explained it the way that I see it to the best of my ability, let's see if anyone else can find some better way to explain it.

The Brethren and the LDS General Authorities.

The Brethren and the LDS General Authorities:

What does it mean to be stiff-necked?

In the original ancient Hebrew, the word for repentance was "shuv" which meant to turn around and go a different direction. You could turn around and go into the dark, or you could turn around and go into the light.

Eventually, repentance became "Teshuvah", which means to "turn around and face God" or to "turn to God".

The stiff-necked? They are unwilling or unable to turn their head and face God. Their neck is stiff. They will not or cannot turn and face God. They cannot repent or will not repent.

Notice that the Book of Mormon uses the word "stiff-necked" all the time, which shows that the Book of Mormon had ancient Hebrew origins. The stiff-necked cannot turn and face God. They cannot or will not turn to God; and by extension, they will not listen to the Prophets of God.

http://hebrew4christians.net/Articles/Teshuvah/teshuvah.html

http://hebrew4christians.com/Holidays/Fall_Holidays/Elul/Teshuvah/teshuvah.html

In our time according to D&C 1:38, we could also say that the "stiff-necked" cannot turn to the Brethren or will not turn to the Brethren for guidance from the Lord. In other words, the "stiff-necked" refuse to sustain the Prophets of God. Their necks are stiff.

Have you ever had a stiff neck? It makes it hard to turn your head and makes it hard to turn around.

I find it truly amazing how simple this concept is, yet how many millions and billions seem to get it wrong. Nonetheless, I got it wrong for decades, so I know that it is easy to do.

In the pre-mortal realms, The Brethren were God the Father, Christ Jehovah, and the Holy Ghost. Those who chose to follow them completed their First Estate and came here to mortality. Those who rejected The Brethren in the pre-existence were cast out of Heaven and became Satan and the devils. Rejecting The Brethren has serious consequences.

Amos 3:7

7 Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.

D&C 1:37-38

37 Search these commandments, for they are true and faithful, and the prophecies and promises which are in them shall all be fulfilled.

38 What I the Lord have spoken, I have spoken, and I excuse not myself; and though the heavens and the earth pass away, my word shall not pass away, but shall all be fulfilled, whether by mine own voice or by the voice of my servants, it is the same.

It is possible for anyone to refuse to turn his head and heart to God and His Chosen Prophets. Being stiff-necked is not limited only to a refusal to sustain and accept God. The term "stiff-necked" or being stiff-necked against God does indeed take the Brethren and LDS General Authorities into consideration as well; but of course, you either choose to believe that it is so, or not. It's a decision or a choice, but it's a choice that only you can make for yourself.

The Lord's official servants are His Chosen Prophets according to Amos 3: 7. The Lord's Servants mentioned in D&C 1: 38 in modern times are the LDS General Authorities, the LDS Missionaries, Your Stake Presidency, Your Local Bishopric, Your Elder's Quorum President or High Priest Group Leader, Your Relief Society Presidency if you are female, and your parents. Whenever they speak as moved upon by the Holy Ghost, it is the word of the Lord and the voice of the Lord unto you. Your stiff-neck comes into play whenever you refuse to hearken and obey the words of the Lord that come to you through them. That's how the neck gets stiff. I know, because I have had inexplicable problems with a stiff neck for most of my life. One day, I finally figured out the cause.

D&C 68:2-6

2 And, behold, and lo, this is an ensample unto all those who were ordained unto this priesthood, whose mission is appointed unto them to go forth --

3 And this is the ensample unto them, that they shall speak as they are moved upon by the Holy Ghost.

4 And whatsoever they shall speak when moved upon by the Holy Ghost shall be scripture, shall be the will of the Lord, shall be the mind of the Lord, shall be the word of the Lord, shall be the voice of the Lord, and the power of God unto salvation.

5 Behold, this is the promise of the Lord unto you, O ye my servants.

6 Wherefore, be of good cheer, and do not fear, for I the Lord am with you, and will stand by you; and ye shall bear record of me, even Jesus Christ, that I am the Son of the living God, that I was, that I am, and that I am to come.

In this scripture, the Servants are Brethren, priesthood ordained LDS Missionaries. If you refuse to listen to, sustain, and accept the Brethren, the Lord's duly anointed Servants, it will be held against you at the last day; and, it won't serve you well while you are here in mortality either. But as usual, we are each free to shoot ourselves in the foot any time we want to do so, thus leaving us nothing to stand on in the end.

Many apostates derisively call those, who sustain the LDS General Authorities, Brethrenites. The apostates and disaffected often stand in the Large and Spacious Building pointing the finger at the Brethrenites and mocking them.

Nevertheless, there is indeed a Brethrenite Movement within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints; and, I see it as a good thing. I have recently found a desire to be a part of them. I have developed a desire to support, sustain, and hearken unto the Brethren, or the LDS General Authorities. I now seek for the times when they speak as moved upon by the Holy Ghost and try to let the Holy Ghost drive their message home into my heart.


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Is it I Lord?

Is it I who will betray you and your chosen servants, the Prophets?

Am I one of those who will stone your Prophets, either by word or by deed?

Am I the one who will crucify you afresh?

Is it I Lord?

Proof of God

A website that might interest you is done by John Pratt. He is an LDS Astronomer and his specialty is Sacred Calendars or Divine Calendars and the Holy Days of the Sacred Calendars. A study of his many articles not only provides convincing proof of God's existence but also provides convincing proof that God is in control of it all and knows exactly what He is doing.

http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/index.html

http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/article_nums.html

http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/dates.html

Particularly useful to lay the foundation:

http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2004/truths.html

http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2004/planets.html

Of course, like any proof, you will have to be willing to accept the evidence (or postulates) as true, before it will have any meaning or value to you; and obviously, you will have to be willing to look and see.

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Another helpful link related to this topic:

http://en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_prophets/Revelation_after_Joseph_Smith

I started a thread that may (or may not) prove helpful.  We'll have to see if I get any additional input that is useful.  We can only hope.

http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=33533

I also started a thread that has moved into being an "evidence for God" kind of thread; but, you will have to Register on LDS Freedom Forum in order to see this thread.

http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=33514

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I was asked to supply supporting sources for some of my claims.  Of particular interest to me was the fact that the person wanted me to supply instances of LDS prophets after Brigham Young having seen and conversed with our resurrected Lord Jesus Christ.

I responded as follows:

The link given below is excellent. Click it and see. What you are looking for is at the bottom.

http://en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_ ... seph_Smith

Isn't it interesting how it doesn't count unless it happened after Brigham Young? Don't let it bother you, my friend, because I think it is meant to be that way for a reason. I was that way for decades. It didn't count unless it happened after Brigham Young. I believe that many of us have that feeling in order to keep us searching and looking. And, in a sense, we are right. It doesn't count unless it is happening here and now in our time and in our lives.  The revelations and visions given to the dead prophets are often not as useful to us as the revelations and visions given to the Living Prophets.

Also look at:

http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=33514

http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=31742



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While searching for evidence of God, I found or was pointed to:

http://ofgodandgoddesses.blogspot.com/

http://www.templestudies.org/home/

The Temple Studies group seems to be an inter-denominational group of theists who start with the assumption that God exists, and then they talk about the consequences or results of that assumption.

The Of God and Goddesses blog is a summary or an introduction to the Temple Studies group.  The approach is something like, "Assuming that God really exists, what does all that mean to you and me?"

The following essays are indirect logic proofs of Gods existence, but as usual require the reader to buy into the initial assumptions.

http://ofgodandgoddesses.blogspot.com/2014/05/of-god-and-goddesses-another-copy-just.html

http://ofgodandgoddesses.blogspot.com/2014/05/of-god-and-goddesses.html

In conclusion, it's impossible to find a convincing proof of God for anyone who as chosen not to believe in God or has chosen not to look and see.  Belief in God takes a leap of faith.

The Condescension of God

Over at LDS Freedom Forum, there is a thread entitled, "I Have Seen the Savior".

http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=31742

I have found parts of that thread extremely beautiful and enlightening.

Someone asked, "What does the Condescension of God mean?"

I responded:

The condescension of God took place when Christ Jehovah condescended to leave His Heavenly throne as a God and come down here to mortality and earth as Jesus to suffer with us, help us, be with us, and be as if He were one of us. He came down here to see things and experience things from our point of view. Before He left Heaven, He already knew that He would win by failing. He would win by being crucified and experiencing death, just like the rest of us will experience failure and death in some form or another before the end of our lives. As mortal beings, we each have a battle looming ahead of us that we each are destined to fail or lose. Mortals by definition are destined to die, and there's nothing we can do about it. Death is the ultimate failure. Now Jesus Christ knows what it is like to have to face and suffer death. That's the condescension of God.

The bitter cup is hell. The bitter cup is spiritual death. And, in the Garden of Gethsemane, Jesus Christ drank a whole gallon of hell on our behalf, so that we wouldn't have to, so long as we are willing to accept Him on faith and repent of our sins. Drinking the bitter cup on our behalf, that is the condescension of God! Christ is trying to win us over to His side by His willingness to suffer and die on our behalf. God is the one making the ultimate sacrifice, not us. That's what makes Him the one true God, because He put His life and His spirituality on the line for our sake.

The Nature of the Beast

When you come out and publicly state that you no longer support Thomas S. Monson as the President and the Prophet of the LDS Church, or publicly state that you no longer support the LDS Apostles as Prophets, Seers, and Revelators, then there is really no reason for them to keep you as a member of the LDS Church. When you step away from these men and no longer sustain them, you are no longer a member of the LDS Church in your heart, whether you have been excommunicated or not. If you honestly say that you no longer sustain these men as Prophets, Seers, and Revelators, they cannot give you a Temple Recommend and there's really no reason for them to keep you around as a member either. That's just the nature of the beast.

Yes, you are welcome to attend the meetings; and, I know from personal experience that many kind, charitable, compassionate, and loving people at the LDS Church will help you in every way possible, whether you are a member of the LDS Church or not.  But, you won't be able to get a Temple Recommend if you refuse to sustain the Brethren or refuse to keep the commandments of God.  I don't have a Temple Recommend, and there are reasons for it.  I know of what I speak; and, I know what I need to repent of.

These men (the LDS Church General Authorities) hold the keys to the door. If you say that you no longer want to have anything to do with them, they give you what you want.  They show you the door, because there is nothing else that they can do for you.  That's just the way it works. It worked that way during Christ's time, and it works that way today.  You have to be willing to meet them half way.  You have to be willing to keep Christ's commandments, or there is nothing that Christ can do to help you.

It also worked that way in the pre-existence in the Council in Heaven. Those who said that they didn't want to have anything to do with Christ, His Plan, and the Father's Plan got exactly what they wanted. God didn't force them to stay. God showed them the door, and they walked through it of their own free will and choice, and found themselves on the outside where they wanted to be. God is not going to force you to stay if you do not want to stay.  That's the nature of the beast.

You have to be active to be Active.

Speaking evil of the Lord's Anointed results in being separated from the Lord's Anointed.  It comes naturally and automatically.  When we separate ourselves from the Brethren or the Lord's Anointed, we suddenly find ourselves separated from the Lord's Anointed and the Brethren.  It's strange how it works out that way.  It's magic!

Regarding Poverty

Regarding Poverty:

People keep asking who I am. Who I am doesn't matter. What matters is that I know of what I speak. For years (for decades even), I was one of the poor (physically poor, spiritually poor, financially poor) who stood on the outside looking in. I know what it is like to be in that position. I know some of the thoughts that go through your mind when you are in that position. I know what you think about the Brethren, the wealthy, the privileged, and the healthy.

It makes me laugh whenever someone tries to paint poverty as some kind of virtue. The physically poor (unhealthy) are some of the most miserable people on this earth. There's no virtue there. The spiritually poor (apostates) are some of the most angry, hateful, vindictive, vengeful people on this earth. There's no virtue there. The financially poor (penniless) are some of the most jealous, frustrated, cynical, critical people on this earth. There's no virtue there. Poverty is not a virtue. You can only lift people to the level that you have already attained. Poverty is hell, the exact opposite of the Celestial Kingdom. The Celestial Kingdom is life, and life more abundantly.

Then people jump up and down and say, “But, Jesus was poor. I know He was poor; and, He was the best one of us all. There has got to be something to it if Jesus was doing it.” Oh, you silly people. Think!!

Let's start with physical poverty. When it came to Jesus and His physical health, He was a thousand times stronger and a million times more durable than any one of us. Why? Jesus was the son of an immortal indestructible God. Jesus Christ was NOT subject to the fall. Jesus Christ was NOT a fallen being like the rest of us. Jesus was NOT subject to death and sin like the rest of us. In many respects, Jesus was like a Terrestrial translated being, when it came to His powers and abilities and health. Jesus could have walked down from the cross healing Himself in real time as He went, if He chose to do so. Physical poverty? Nothing of the sort. Jesus was able to take the whole weight of the universe's sins and death on His shoulders and carry the whole load, and survive to tell about it. I see no poverty there.

How about spiritual poverty? Again, Jesus Christ was NOT a fallen being and was not subject to the Fall. Jesus therefore was not subject to sin and death like the rest of us are. Mortality and death in many respects is the ultimate sin or the ultimate failure. We simply fail and die. We do not have the spiritual wherewithal to sustain ourselves. Jesus walked and talked with God the Father, because there was no barrier between them. Jesus was the pinnacle of spiritual attainment and spiritual enlightenment on this earth. Jesus raised Himself from the dead – the greatest spiritual achievement. So, was Jesus spiritually poor? Nope. The exact opposite! Jesus was a wealth of spirituality.

Now, everyone is complaining and saying, “But, Jesus was financially poor and had no stocks, bonds, corporations, or governments to His name. We have to do the same and be the same if we want to be like Jesus.” Oh, you silly people. Stop and think about!!

Jesus Christ is the rightful heir to the whole earth. When it comes time for God the Father to sign over the deed for the whole earth, Jesus Christ's name is going to be the name on the Title. Jesus is going to own the whole thing – lock, stock, and barrel. Jesus knew that it would be so, even while Jesus lived here on this earth. Jesus is the LORD of Lords and the KING of Kings. The buck stops there.

One day, every corporation on this earth will belong to Jesus. In fact, they already do. Every building and plant on this earth will belong to Jesus. In fact, they already do. Even now, every particle and every atom in your body belongs to Jesus because He bought and paid for it all with His own blood. Your very breath belongs to Jesus. Your very soul belongs to Jesus, because He bought and paid for it with His own blood. Jesus is the designated heir to it all; and, Jesus has already paid the price. All that is left is for Him to come and take ownership in person, when He is ready to do so.

The nice thing is that Jesus apparently likes to share; but, it is all His now. He has bought and paid for it all and redeemed it all with His own blood. Every corporation, inside and outside of the LDS Church already belongs to Christ, whether they know it or not. Every building and resource on this planet already belongs to Christ, whether we accept that fact or not. It is His to do with as He pleases. Every particle and atom is His.

Jesus is poor? Come on people! Think! Second to only God the Father, Jesus Christ is the wealthiest being in the whole universe. There is no vow of poverty there where Jesus Christ is concerned. He owns the whole thing, including your very soul. Jesus is a God, and you are His, whether you believe in Him or not. Jesus owns you; and, He can do with you as He pleases. Jesus is the template and exemplar for a saved and exalted being – infinite wealth, infinite glory, infinite power, and infinite ownership. Thankfully, Jesus has already demonstrated an infinite gift for love and mercy, and He seems to like to share; otherwise, we would all be in deep trouble.

The Bloggernacle Survival List

The Bloggernacle Survival List:

1. On this forum (LDS Freedom Forum), and on every other Bloggernacle Forum, there is one book that should be required reading for every participant who hopes to survive the experience spiritually intact. That book is “The Inevitable Apostasy” by Tad R. Callister. Why? Think about it. That book lists many of the different traps that those before us fell into before they apostatized, left the Primitive Church, fell away from the Church, refused to sustain the Living Apostles, or were excommunicated from the Church. That book shows us how the Great Apostasy took place and thus shows us many different ways how our current apostasies and excommunications have taken place and are now taking place.

For example. In that book we are told and shown that in the Primitive Church, there were many different Bishops (and branch presidents) who were gathering a following around themselves; and then, when they had their following or congregation, they simply refused to let the Living Apostles (Paul, John, and others) come into their congregation and teach their congregation. Once these Bishops had achieved their following or their congregation, they simply cast out the Apostles and refused to sustain and accept the Apostles, and would not let the Apostles see or talk to their congregation members. These Bishops refused to give the Apostles a list of their church's membership. The members of their congregation were simply cut-off from access to the Apostles of the Lord.

Furthermore, these Bishops told their congregations not to listen to the Apostles because the teachings of the Apostles were wrong and inadequate. These Bishops taught their followers to hate, fear, and reject the Living Apostles. These Bishops taught their followers that they didn't need the Living Apostles in order to be saved in Christ's church. These Bishops taught their followers that all they need is Christ. Does any of this sound familiar?

It happened back during the Primitive Church, and it continues to happen today. It explains a few things why the LDS General Authorities do the things that they do. It explains why the Brethren act so quickly and decisively whenever this kind of thing starts to happen. It explains why your favorite Institute teacher suddenly gets fired and told to go do something else. It's because that Institute teacher has started to build a following and some of his (or her) students were starting to see that Institute teacher as the only True Prophet on the earth since Joseph Smith. One of the quickest ways to get excommunicated from the LDS Church (or to lose your LDS Church job) is to build a following, and then have some of your followers start saying that you are the only True Prophet or the only True Apostle since Joseph Smith. Whether you are telling your students to say that, or not, it makes no difference, because it is happening none-the-less. You are building a following, and your followers are leaving the Church so that they can follow you; and, they will follow you right into your excommunication, whether you want them to or not.

Please do NOT follow me or my past example. (I don't want to be excommunicated.) I rejected many of the teachings of the Living Prophets, and I went over ten years without sustaining any of the Leaders of the LDS Church. I walked straight into hell and spent many years there. If you follow me, you will simply end up in the same place that I did; and then, you will have to turn around, humble yourself, repent, and find some way out of the dark pit and back into the light.

If you simply can't resist and feel the overwhelming need to following some living man here on this earth (I can understand), then deliberately choose to follow one of the LDS Apostles and/or one of the LDS General Authorities, because on average they are most likely to be going where you want to go. If you don't particularly like the current President of the LDS Church (it happens), then pick one of the other LDS Apostles and follow him instead. These men hold the keys to the doors that you want to pass through and have to pass through on your way to heaven and the Celestial Kingdom.

Ironically, in the Primitive Church, many of the church members would have gotten a lot further if they had simply decided to stop following their Bishop (or Institute teacher) and go follow one of the Apostles instead. In other words, go with the best of what you have available to you. If you can get to where you can develop a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, so much the better. If you have developed a true relationship with Jesus Christ, He will tell you to go and seek out the words and teachings of one of the LDS Apostles anyway.

If some voice is telling you to go with someone else besides one of the 15 LDS Apostles or your Quorum President or your Local Bishop and Stake President or your own righteous Priesthood-holding father, then you know that that voice is coming from Satan or one of his followers. If you need help, a true voice will tell you to go to someone who has jurisdiction over you, has been duly called and authorized to serve you, and thus has direct responsibility for your spiritual salvation – someone like your Elder's Quorum President, Bishop, Stake President, righteous Priesthood-holding Temple-Recommend-holding father, one of the LDS General Authorities, or one of the LDS Apostles. If a voice tells you to follow and obey someone else, ignore it, because that voice is coming from Satan.

2. Those who participate in the Bloggernacle need a firm understanding of the Parable of the Ten Virgins – the implications, the results, and the ramifications of that parable. (Matthew 25: 1-13).

The Ten Virgins in the parable are the Latter-day Saints, the members of the LDS Church in our day and time. The Ten Virgins are the ones who have, through baptism and Temple Ordinances, been invited to the wedding feast of the Bridegroom, who is Jesus Christ. They are the ones who have lamps or the Holy Ghost to guide them through the dark night towards the wedding feast. Some fill their lamps with oil, some do not.

Yes, the oil represents spirituality, but it also represents so much more. The oil represents the gift of the Holy Ghost and actively receiving the Holy Ghost. The oil also represents a Temple Recommend and a determination to keep all temple covenants at all times and in all places to the end of their lives. The oil also represents standing or sitting in conference a few times a year, raising their arms to the square and willingly, deliberately, and eagerly sustaining the LDS Apostles as Prophets, Seers, and Revelators, as well as sitting in local ward conference and willingly, deliberately, and eagerly sustaining their local Bishop and ward leaders and really meaning it when they do so. The oil also represents paying an honest tithe throughout their lives. The oil represents reading the words of the Living Prophets and General Authorities and deliberately and willingly choosing to follow the counsel therein. The oil represents a willful decision or a willful desire to keep the commandments of God. The oil represents choosing your Bloggernacle forums, gurus, decisions, conclusions, and teachings carefully; and, choosing the right ones who are going to the wedding feast so that you can go with them. The oil even represents a decision to keep the Word of Wisdom.

What's the result? The result is that half of the Latter-day Saints fill their lamps or vessels or bodies with oil, which they will then use to guide themselves to this great wedding feast. And, the unfortunate result is that half of the Latter-day Saints either through apathy or deliberate choice fail to fill their lamps with oil. Half of the Latter-day Saints go to the wedding feast; and, half of the Latter-day Saints fall away into inactivity, apostasy, excommunication, a refusal to pay tithing, a loss of Temple Blessings, or a refusal to sustain their Church Leaders both local and general.

What are the ramifications of this parable? It has already been fulfilled many times, and it will continue to be fulfilled from this very moment right up to the Second Coming of Christ. During the Kirtland Apostasy in 1838, the LDS Church lost half of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles to apostasy and excommunication. These Apostles who apostatized failed to fill their lamps with oil. They organized and cast out the righteous Apostles who remained, even threatening to kill them, because the apostates no longer sustained the Leaders of the Church and were no longer willing to keep the covenants they had made in baptism.

Between the Kirtland Apostasy and now, we have lost half of the Latter-day Saints to apathy, to inactivity, to a refusal to pay tithing, to a refusal to get and keep Temple Covenants, to a refusal to attend the Temple, to a refusal to keep the commandments of God, to rebellion, to a refusal to sustain the Apostles and President of the Church, to hurt feelings, to a determination to take offense whenever they get the chance to take offense, to false theories of men, to apostate groups that have broken away from the church, to false prophets who seem more desirable than the duly Anointed Prophets, to anger and dissatisfaction, to a refusal to pray and study the LDS Scriptures, to deliberate sin, to a refusal to keep the Word of Wisdom, to addictions, to excommunication, to a refusal to attend church and partake of the sacrament, to laziness, to entertainment and entitlement, to pride, to apostasy, and to a refusal to sustain Church Leaders both local and general. The list could go on for many pages more. Suffice it to say that for one reason or another, half of the Latter-day Saints have failed to fill their lamps with oil throughout the history of our Gospel Restoration during the Fullness of Times.

So, do you want to predict the future? It should be rather simple to do so, unfortunately. Between now and the Second Coming of Christ, half of the Latter-day Saints are going to fail to fill their lamps with oil. It has already happened in the past, and it will continue to happen into the future. Half of us are going to fall away somewhere along the way. I see it happening around me each and every day, especially on the Bloggernacle. It has happened all around us in the past, and it will continue to happen from here-on until the Second Coming of Christ, where some of us will not be recognized by the Lord and will be burned as a result. Why? It's because some of us will not have the Holy Ghost within us to protect us from Christ's full glory when He comes. We didn't sustain His Duly Authorized Anointed Ones while we had the chance to do so; and thus, Christ and the Holy Ghost will not and cannot sustain us when He comes.

The good news is that half of us are going to find some way to fill our lamps with oil and then keep our lamps filled.

3. Those who participate in the Bloggernacle need a firm understanding of Paul's conversion story (Acts 9: 1-31), and the conversion story of Alma the Younger and the Sons of Mosiah. (Mosiah 27 and Alma 36.) They need to understand how these men murdered the Saints of God, both physically and spiritually, including committing spiritual suicide. And then, they need to understand the steps that these men had to take in order to come back and be fully restored to Christ's grace. These men were led astray (and then led others astray), and because of their fore-ordination in the pre-existence, Christ had to intervene in their lives and cause a course correction.

Why is this important?

If someone on the Bloggernacle leads you away from the Church, gets you excommunicated, or gets you disaffected with your Church Leaders so that you have apostatized from the Church, Paul and Alma and the Sons of Mosiah show you the humbling steps you have to take in order to repent and come back into the Church.

In Paul's case, after Christ appeared to him and blinded him, Christ sent Paul to his Local Bishop, Ananias, so that Paul could receive his sight, receive further teachings, receive support, receive baptism, receive food, receive a forgiveness of his sins through the Saving Ordinances, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, receive the Priesthood, and receive the Brethren or Church Leadership. If you have fallen away and been excommunicated, you are going to have to go see your Bishop and go through the same exact process in order to come back. There is no other way. The person who led you away from the Church isn't going to be able to bring you back.

In Alma's case, he was taken to his Priesthood-holding father and Prophet of the Church, who gave him priesthood blessings to sustain his life, and then taught him and baptized him and confirmed him and gave him the Priesthood, after it had become clear that Alma the Younger had truly repented and had been converted to Christ.

The Sons of Mosiah went to their righteous Priesthood-holding father for a similar treatment. They had to turn around and start over. It's as if they were reborn. They then went out and tried to repair the damage that they had done.

Observe that Paul was guilty of murdering the Saints of God; yet, Christ's grace was sufficient to absolve such a sin, after Paul's repentance and baptism. Alma says that he and the sons of Mosiah were guilty of murdering the spirituality of their followers and the spirituality of Saints of God. We also know that Alma and the sons of Mosiah were also guilty of spiritual suicide and had suffered a spiritual death as a result. These are serious crimes. Yet, the scriptures show us and teach us that Christ's grace is sufficient to cover and redeem these kinds of crimes and sins.

If the Bloggernacle or one of the pretenders succeeds in getting you excommunicated, know that it has happened to others before you; and more importantly, know that there are steps already in place that you can take in order to come back. For many who have been excommunicated or have left the Church, the greatest obstacle that they usually have to overcome is a lack of desire to come back. They have to overcome their pride. My Bishop told me that every sin can be overcome and surmounted, except for a lack of desire to come back. If you can't overcome a lack of desire to come back, then you simply will not be able to come back because you will have no desire to do so. Everything else can be handled and dealt with in a proper manner, even if it means spending some time in prison or spending some time as an excommunicated member of the church.

After I had apostatized from the LDS Church, these are the exact same steps I had to go through in order to come back. In the beginning, I had to be willing to open my door and let my Bishopric come see me and minister to me. I let my younger brother (a Priesthood holder) teach me, when I told him that I no longer believed in God. He came to see me often after I had hit rock bottom. I had to be willing to open my door and let the Ward Missionaries come see me and teach me. I had to then be willing to repent of my addictions and many of my sins. I had to be willing to go to church. I had to be willing to go to ward socials. I had to be willing to listen to my wife and do as she said. I had to be willing to open my door and let my High Priest Group leader come in and minister to me. I had to be willing to open my door and let my Home Teachers teach me and serve me. I eventually had to be willing to accept a calling to be a Home Teacher, with my High Priest Group Leader as my senior companion.

I had to be willing to take my dogs on long walks and learn the lessons that they had to teach me. By helping a small little dog to overcome some of her fears, she helped me to overcome my own. I got to see their love for life, and try to bring some of that into my soul. The dogs taught me how to love again. Eventually, I had to go see my Bishop and develop a plan. I had to gain my testimony back again. I eventually had to be willing and eager to accept a calling as one of the Quorum Instructors in my High Priest's Group. Now, I am working and striving to get my Temple Recommend back. That's the way it goes. It takes effort and time. I had to make a decision to turn around and come back. I had to be reborn, and start all over again.

Notice that it was the duly authorized servants or duly authorized Priesthood holders directly over me and directly responsible for me who had to come to me, had to help bring me back, and had to help me make and take the steps necessary in order to come back. Eventually, when I was ready, I started going to them! I started going to church every Sunday, where I could be around a whole bunch of the Lord's Anointed. In summary, I had to learn how to come back the right way, and then choose to do so. What a blessing! Repentance is one of Christ's greatest gifts to us. It's definitely a Pearl of Great Price.

4. To survive the Bloggernacle spiritually intact, you need a firm determination to sustain all of your Church Leaders, all the way from your Local Bishop and Local Relief Society President and Local Elder's Quorum President to the LDS Apostles and Prophet of the LDS Church. You cannot turn away from these men (these Anointed Ones) and turn to someone else or to something else and then expect to survive spiritually or remain faithful to the end. It just can't be done. It's going to require more than just accepting Christ as your personal Savior; after all, the Catholics and Protestants have already done that, and it won't get them an invitation to the wedding feast. To get that precious invitation to the wedding feast, it is going to require humility, baptism into the LDS Church, a Temple Recommend, a refusal to take offense, a Temple Endowment, church attendance, a determination to stay faithful to the end, keeping your covenants, paying your tithing, prayer, reading and accepting the LDS Scriptures, reading and accepting and eagerly following the teachings of the Living Prophets, choosing the right, a decision not to turn or stray from the straight and narrow path (or the Iron Rod), and a deliberate decision to sustain the LDS Apostles, the Lord's Anointed (Temple Endowed), and the President of the LDS Church whether you like them or not. This how the righteous Latter-day Saints (the wise Virgins) before us survived, and it's how we will now survive as well.

5. Those who want to survive spiritually on the Bloggernacle have to learn and accept some hard truths. For example: The Lord's Anointed in modern times consists of the Temple Recommend holders of the LDS Church. As I see it, every baptized LDS Church member has received the Calling or has been Called. It's the LDS Temple Recommend holders who have received the Election, or have been Elected, or have been Endowed. After that, it is up to the Holy Ghost and the individual to make the calling and election Sure.

Now, for the hard truth. Those who have been excommunicated from the LDS Church are no longer a part of the Elected. The excommunicated are no longer the Lord's Anointed. They have fallen from that position. It doesn't matter what they accomplished before, even if they had become one of the Twelve Apostles before they were excommunicated. If they are excommunicated, their anointings and election have been taken away from them, and they no longer have any divine authority whatsoever. They have fallen from that position and now have to start all over again. They have to be reborn again. This reality applied to Sidney Rigdon, Oliver Cowdery, David Whitmer, and Martin Harris – special witnesses and Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ. If any of them decided to come back, they had to start all over again from scratch. They had to be re-baptized and receive the ordinances and receive the Priesthood all over again. They had to be anointed again. That's just the way it was. Why? It's because they had lost these things when they were excommunicated.

The same principles apply today. If you are excommunicated from the LDS Church, you are no longer one of the Lord's Anointed, even if you saw Christ during your prior Church membership as Oliver Cowdery and Sidney Rigdon did. If Christ's brings you back into the Church, it will be through the gate by faith, repentance, baptism, reception of the gift of the Holy Ghost, reception of the Priesthood by someone duly authorized to give you that Priesthood, and reception of your Temple Blessings or Temple Anointings. You will have to go through one of the Brethren or one of the LDS Church General Authorities, to receive these things back again.

If Christ speaks to you or brings you back into the Church, He will send you to your Priesthood Leaders to receive these blessings back.

Christ will NOT send you to the excommunicated church member down the street or to the Bloggernacle king to get your blessings back. It doesn't work that way. If some voice or prompting tells you to go to some excommunicated member of the church and follow him, you know that that voice came from Satan.

Why make this list? I have noticed that the Bloggernacle is a hotbed of apostasy and excommunication. They are apostatizing and being excommunicated right and left on the Bloggernacle. If you are determined to live on the Bloggernacle, you are going to have to learn to recognize the signs of apostasy and the lures to apostatize from the LDS Church. They are there on the Bloggernacle to be found. If you fall for one of the traps on the Bloggernacle and get excommunicated, you are going to have to know how to come back, if you want to be saved in the Celestial Kingdom. That's just the way it is. It's the hard truth. It's the reality of the situation. If you fall into a pit, you are going to need some kind of help to get out of it. You are going to need the right kind of help.

6. Of course, as with any list, there are many other things that can go on the list. Take and put on this list whatever it is that is currently giving you a desire to leave the LDS Church and to strike out on your own. And then, put on the list the steps you need to take, the covenants you need to keep, the commandments you need to obey, the teachings and people you need to reject, and the decisions you need to make in order to keep you firmly rooted in the LDS Church, devoted to the LDS Apostles, and firm in the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Put on this list whatever you need to do in order to fill the oil in your lamp and in order to build a firm foundation upon the Gospel Principles and Gospel Ordinances both within your heart and in your life. Put on this list whatever you need to do (or avoid) to keep you from apostatizing and leaving the LDS Church. Put on this list whatever you need to do or find in order to overcome your pride and fear. Then, when you have been converted, strengthen your brethren and sisters.

I Respect But Feel Sorry for My Homosexual Friends

I have many friends who are homosexual. They seem to gravitate towards me for some unexplained reason; maybe it's because I treat them as human beings and treat them as friends. Some of them have decided to pursue a gay lifestyle; and, some of them have decided to remain celibate for life. Some of them are Mormon, and some of them are not. Some have fallen for gay sex and are now trying to repent of it. Some have attempted suicide.

No matter their current situation, they each pay a high price for their choices and for the aspects of their condition that they cannot change or overcome; and, I feel sorry for them.

Most of them have proven to be very nice wonderful people who have just happened to fall into an unfortunate situation. I look at homosexuality much like an illness, such as influenza or cancer or alcoholism or some such.

When it comes to influenza, there's not much you can do to keep from getting it. It comes when it comes, and it can take months or even years to get over it. The scars from it can sometimes last for a life-time. Some of my celibate homosexual friends seem to fall into this case study or model or comparison. And, I know of some who have gotten over it well enough that they are able to function and live in a heterosexual relationship. I know of others who have chosen to remain celibate, and have chosen not to date anyone.

Again, there's usually not much you can do to prevent yourself from getting cancer. If it's determined to come, there's not much you can do to stop it. Getting over cancer can take years and some extreme therapy, and some people simply never get over it. They die before they get over it. I know of some who have fought their homosexual tendencies all their lives with no success whatsoever. They can't overcome it, no matter how much they want to do so or pray to do so. A thousand temple visits hasn't gotten them over it. They don't even experience moments of remission. They don't like it, but have found no way to overcome it. It's a situation that is going to have to be resolved for them in the next life. They don't like being that way, and I feel sorry for them.

Alcoholism, much like a gay lifestyle, is a result of choices that you make along the way; and, they both can be addictive and nearly impossible to overcome. I have known some people who have killed themselves with drink or other addictions. Most of my homosexual friends who have chosen a gay lifestyle fit into this overall category. There were choices they made along the way that led them into a gay relationship; yet, the feelings of love that they have for their chosen partner seem to be as real as the feelings I have for my wife and posterity, sometimes even more so, because they have had to pay dearly and sacrifice a lot for the relationship. The friends I have (in and out of the LDS Church), who have chosen a gay relationship, currently have no desires to pursue a heterosexual relationship. They seem to be satisfied with their choice.

Bisexuals can go either way. Their condition is most influenced by environmental or social conditions. They can live a gay lifestyle, yet give it up at will and switch the other way. The successful “repentance” stories in the LDS Church where people repent of their homosexuality and become heterosexual consist mostly of Latter-day Saints who are truly bisexual in their orientation. The successful reparative therapy stories fit this mold as well. If they want to be heterosexual, they can be at will. Females seem to have an easier time with this (orientation switching) than males do. Females do not need a physical attraction in order to function in a heterosexual relationship; males do.

I'm overjoyed that the Lord saw fit to throw my orientation switch the heterosexual direction when it came time for that switch to be thrown. Like I said, my homosexual friends pay a heavy price for their affliction or their cross in life. I have children and a grandchild, and each one of them has a piece of me inside of them. That can be quite a satisfying and enjoyable feeling, even for a man. My homosexual friends who are celibate or who pursue a gay relationship will never have children that have a piece of them inside them. They have no branches. Some of them even deny their roots. I feel sorry for them, and I'm glad it didn't happen to me; but, I still like these people nonetheless.

They pay a heavy price. Many of them are left without root (no sealing to their forefathers in a temple of God); and, they are left without branch (no physical posterity and no posterity sealed to them in a temple of God). Their situation has been talked about in each of the LDS scriptures. Imagine what would have happened if Adam, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, or Jacob had decided to pursue a homosexual relationship or had decided that they didn't want to get married and have the responsibility of children. There would have been no branches or nations, as a result.

3 Ne 25:1

1 FOR behold, the day cometh that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble; and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of Hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

D&C 133:64

64 And also that which was written by the prophet Malachi: For, behold, the day cometh that shall burn as an oven, and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble; and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

JS-H 1:37

37 For behold, the day cometh that shall burn as an oven, and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly shall burn as stubble; for they that come shall burn them, saith the Lord of Hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

Mal 4:1

1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

Being left without branch (posterity) is a heavy price to have to pay for a condition or an illness that the person never remembers having sought.

People who suffer from homosexuality can be great friends – they understand what it is like to suffer and can have a great deal of compassion as a result. As long as they understand that they will never convert me to homosexuality and as long as I understand that I will never convert them to heterosexuality, we can have a wonderful time together and great friendships.

The ones I don't like and don't like being around are the ones that turned activist and are trying to convert me to homosexuality and are trying to ram their homosexuality down my throat. They throw a parade, celebrate their wickedness, preach and proselytize their homosexuality 24/7. I don't want what they are trying to sell me. I have seen myself naked in the mirror after a shower, and all I can say is “no-how” and “no-way”. It's not for me.

The lesbians have it easier than the males, imho. Honestly, the thought of a young child having two mommies is actually a pleasant thought. It's much like the polygamist situation and Sister Wives, where the children have more than one mommy as a result. For a young child, one mommy is worth ten daddies. However, the thought of a young child having two daddies is a downright creepy thought for most of us. Lesbian acts are impotent – they are going nowhere and come across as harmless. In contrast, what's involved in male-on-male sexuality is gross to think about and is the stuff of nightmares for many of us – it's a disease-ridden process. I don't want to be Bubba's wife. That's my worst nightmare. The anus wasn't designed to have things going into it.

Every situation and choice has its consequences, blessings, and curses as a result. If you want children of your own with a piece of you inside of them, a heterosexual relationship is the best and cheapest way to go about that goal. If you are the type of person who doesn't want to be a parent and doesn't want to have children yet have some kind of companionship in life, a homosexual relationship can be one of the best ways to go about that goal. Each choice has its consequences, blessings, and shortcomings.

This is a true principle:

D&C 130:20-21

20 There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated--

21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.

If you want the blessings of a homosexual relationship (and there are some), it's by obedience to the law upon which it is predicated, a homosexual relationship or gay marriage. If you want a college degree, it's by obedience to the law and conditions upon which it is predicated. If you want to be the father of nations, it's by obedience to the law upon which that blessing is predicated. Being a father or mother has its price, and it can be quite a curse at times.

If you don't want children, yet end up in a heterosexual relationship(s) with ten children of your own and a nagging wife or a bunch of ex-wives, it can be a bit of a hell on earth. Likewise, if you want children of your own, homosexual tendencies can be hell on earth. I wanted children of my own, so I'm glad I ended up with heterosexual tendencies.

Some aspects of it come down to your desires and goals in life. Some people simply do not want to become “fathers or mothers of nations”; and, some people do. If you want to become a father of nations or a mother of nations, or if you want to become a God or Goddess, a heterosexual relationship is the best way to go about that goal. On the other hand, there are other kingdoms and other mansions for the people who don't want any part of it. We shouldn't begrudge, envy, resent, or hate people simply because they want or need to go some other direction with their lives. The other Kingdoms are there waiting for them, and I believe they will be happy therein.

Just know that some of the people who suffer from homosexual tendencies just happen to be some of my best and most favorite friends. If I make it to the Celestial Kingdom, I can visualize myself as one of the people who will be visiting them and ministering to them in the other Kingdoms as time permits. I like them, and I like being around them. Of course, I have many heterosexual friends that I like and like being around as well; and, I do want and have wanted children of my own. So, I know which path is right for me.